Crossdressers-Haven.com

I'd like to get everyone's opinion on this. I've been thinking about it for several days.

In the Honesty thread, Kay(SO) brought out what I felt to be a very valid point. It got buried as the topic mutated but I'd like to bring it back for discussion.

Kay(SO) wrote:I see a huge difference between my wearing a suit and my husband wearing boobs, makeup, a wig, pumps, lingere and a dress. When I wear the suit I'm not wearing prostetics or trying to "pass" as a man and trying to convince the world and myself that I am one.

Just a day or so prior to that, I had exchanged a few messages with Suuzin(F) in which I made this comment to her:

As I don't have a SO, I was thinking a bit speculatively based on some of the posts by SOs and others. If my prospective SO was hetero, as I would want her to be, I was thinking that, since I only wear the clothes and don't try to make myself "appear" feminine, perhaps she wouldn't have the reaction of wanting a man but getting a woman instead. Or maybe avoiding the "you look better than I do" problems that some have posted recently. By retaining my male appearance in all aspects, other than the clothing itself, she could still look at me and see a man. While it may still be difficult to accept the crossdressing, I might avoid some of those other issues that seem to make acceptance more complicated.

So my question is this - Which do you think is more acceptable to SOs, full femme or a man in a dress?

Please understand that I am not saying there is anything wrong with getting totally made up to look as much like a woman as possible. I'm just asking what might be more acceptable?

And I'd like the SOs to please feel free to add their comments.

Hi all,

I suspect most SOs would find neither option more acceptable (or, at least, more attractive) than having a man who doesn't like to dress in women's clothing.

Now, given that a woman is partnered to a crossdresser, I also suspect that, as you say, Kathy, it might be easier for her to handle her DH dressing in some of her clothes, as opposed to having her DH present himself before her as an entirely different-looking person.

Of course, I'm not an SO, so I might just be talking through my hat, here. Indeed, it would be fun to have the SOs chime in on this one. I'm curious.

Love,
CJ

Hi Kathy

Very interesting question you have presented. I can only share with you my experiences with my ex-wife.

She was one of the most supportive spouses someone like us could ask for, but only if I dressed in what she wanted me to dress in. She would pick out outfits and wigs that were not the least bit flattering. She definately had me looking like a guy in a dress. While I was able to dress as often as I wanted I felt hollow inside because I was still not able to be me. Anytime I dressed how I desired a fight would always ensue because I was trying to "show her up". That was never my intention, to me she was and still is the most beautiful lady in the world. I only wanted to be me, I wanted to present the Stef on the outside that I felt on the inside.

I asked her one night why she liked my dressing like that and she said that she still wanted to know that when she looked at me fully dressed she could still see the man she fell in love with.

Hugs,
Stef

Hi Kathy,

My opinion is that given the option, the SO's of CD's would prefer their man remained fully presenting as the man which they were first attracted to. Having said this, I acknowledge that there is a very small percentage of women who actully prefer and seek out a CD as their partner, but on the whole I believe the majority of women would prefer they didn't have it in their life, but the love within a woman is such a strong force, the majority are able to deal with the situation to varying degrees, even though it may not sit completely comfortable within them.

I believe this is a major factor in why women should be given the choice before any relationship is cemented, I believe if the roles were reversed, the majority of men would feel the same and they would react in a more extreme way than women finding out after the marriage.

I believe women being who they are, on average they are better equipped to handle such situations, to varying degrees. I often wonder if the roles were reversed how the husbands and boy friends would come to terms with it if their lady was a F/M CD. How would they handle the situation if their lady went out in public cosmetically transformed to present as a male. I do believe women are better equipped to handle the situation of their partners CDing than males would if the roles were reversed.

I believe that given the choice, that if they have to live their life with CDing, then the majority of women would prefer their man to be a man in a dress rather than the full ensemble, as one of the greatest fears of women is how far will it go and will he ever want to live full time as a woman, the more exacting he looks as a female, the more their fears can grow. It can be an emotional desert for many women because women get great comfort from discussing their problems with other women and mostly women cannot share this with their female friends and have to harbour it all inside them.

Kind Regards.

Sally.

Hi Kathy,

There is not much I can add to what has already been said here, except that I think it might depend some what on who the SO is.

Hi...

Adding my 1 cent worth, I also think that for wives having to deal with their hubbies CDing, may be a bit easier/less threatening if the CDing hubby would look like a guy in a dress.

Why? Because there would be less fear about him wanting to go out enfemme, or wanting to transition, etc. If he manages to even look as an attractive woman, it would be even worse, IMHO.

Gaby

Thank you to all of you who responded. I must admit that, while it has been on my mind for a few days, I'm not sure where this line of thought is taking me yet. I will continue to ponder the question and responses so far and if anything profound comes to me I'll let you know.

More likely it is just my mind trying to sort through the various degrees of crossdressing to find where I fit in.

Thank you again.

Kathy, AS a wife of a CD of course I would prefer he always dress as a man, the man i married.
That being said as my acceptance has grown to where I can enjoy him sometimes as 'her'. For me it does not really matter if it is 'a guy in a dress or all out femm'. In the start I did just see a guy in a dress, but as time passes I am seeing Michelle come out. Sometimes it is just capris, top and sandels other times the full deal, this usually only happens with my help since 'she' cannot seem to get the makeup part. It could be only a nightgown or just panties. Whatever, I am pretty much accepting of it all. 'her' personality does not change so it is still my husband even though the outer trappings have changed.
Also 'she' has her own clothing and makeup. Does not wear mine unless she askes. I really don't enjoy her wearing my things so we go shopping together and pick out what we both think is nice and 'she' will enjoy wearing and I will like to see.
Just my 2 cents on this.
Honey

Ah Ha!
Honey says that her DH/Michelle's personality does not change. Yo! Stef! a little help here! I know that in my case, Deborah, has made a pronounced change in my personality as I have tried to intergrate "her" into me. This can get me into serious trouble, but, I see three different aspects of CD'ing here. One, the guy in women's clothing (passable or not). Two, the guy in women's clothing, with a definite personality alteration brought on by the transistion (passable or not). Three, the guy who has allowed his anima to become part of him 24/7, not a TS, but simply a guy who sees/feels/expresses the feminine traits that he (we) recognize/admire in women!
Deborah

Sorry, a blonde moment? Can I buy a vowel? What is more acceptable?
Well through communication, I think it is up to the "agrived" party, i.e., the SO to set the bounderies with our input of course, Small steps, girls, small steps!"
Deborah

Hi Kathy,

More important than what my spouse is wearing is that my spouse conveys love and attraction for me when we are together. The TG issues are just as much a part of my spouse as his love of music, his favorite car or even his features and the fact that he uses his right hand over his left. I was fortunate enough to know this about him when we were dating and I am not threatened by the physical transformation at all.
I tell my spouse that he is beautiful no matter what his attire and I am fortunate enough to have a spouse who tells me the same.

Hope I helped some with my input,

Lefty

Hey Sis. I love you too honey,

You stated; I see three different aspects of CD'ing here.

CJ's post Are you a Transgenderist? has helped me to understand this a little better I think.

I think we might have been saying what we thought was the same thing, but perhaps wasn't. Darlene, has made a pronounced change in my personality as she has been integrated into me, but for me I am not any different when I am Chuck. I like to say it this way, the presence of Darlene has made a better Chuck. In other words I feel that Chuck is a better person, the same, not different from Darlene.

Yet the information provided by CJ has helped me to believe that what you are saying is true for you, and others here. In that thread you stated;

"So I surmised that even within our own "world" we have our differences, and that you fit the definition of a trangenderist"

I fit the definition of a cross-dresser, and I now think the difference we see between us in this issue is tied into us fitting the different definitions. I would have been surprised if you had said you fit a different definition.

I have found that I have been guilty of thinking because that is the way it is for me it better be that way for you, or something is wrong. (*chuckle*) I now suspect that was putting a wall between me and some of the others here. I now find our differences interesting instead of threatening.

What a great thread and several excellent posts! I've been away for awhile and busy but this caught my eye so I wanted to pipe in.

Where to begin... I think that my husband is different than most of the CD'rs here. Let me explain; he doesn't use a femme name EVER, never refers to himself as someone else other than his male self, doesn't want me to call him a "girl or her", does dress the whole nine yards or nothing and definately doesn't go through a personality change when he's dressing. He basically acts, speaks and is the same whether he's in a suit for work or the women's garb. He doesn't seek outside support at all when it comes to CDing, just me and seems content with that, as long as he can dress when he wants to (of course, we discuss it to make sure it's an okay time for all concerned).

Anyway, so for me. I've always seen him as a man in a dress. He doesn't become more feminine and all of the above mentioned things. In fact, this is one of the reasons I've been able to be so accepting and supportive personally. Once I experienced dressing with him and realized that it's still him underneath it all I was okay with it. Again, that's just me.

So, to answer your question; full femme or a man in a dress? For me it's all the same.

Kay(SO)

This is one of those instances where I wish I still had an SO to discuss these things with. Even if we had discovered this site a year ago, I don't think it would have made much difference in the final outcome. That's just an indication of how far things fell apart.

By the same token, I think if we had discussed things a little more openly, we wouldn't have needed a year to get them on the table. I've mentioned before that my ex helped make me the person I am today. At the beginning of our relationship, she encouraged my dressing, and promoted the development of my femme persona. She even welcomed that part of my life in our bedroom, as she got to explore her "lesbian feelings".

As time wore on, she "let" me dress less and less. My most destructive purges were done at her urging. I couldn't dress at all until after she moved out. It was still a month or two before I could "allow myself" the luxury of buying myself something.

Now she tells everyone that we broke up "because he's a crossdresser", just because it's easier (for her) than to tell people that our marriage slowly fell apart due to multiple causes on both sides. I'm filing our divorce papers next week, and I've left out all mention of any indiscretions on her part, just so she won't counter with any sort of official recognition of my "hobbies".

I love her to death, but sometimes that woman just makes me crazy.

Well, the only thing I can say is that she will never learn from her mistakes when she continues to hide from the real causes of her troubles. Others will see this in her from other mistakes she makes and will start to see the truth about why you two split.

Those who hide will always be found out by others. We of all people should know this. So have heart and courage to live your life as you want now that you are free.