Crossdressers-Haven.com

CJ wrote in another thread

From all that I've read in the last thirty years on the psychosexual development of heterosexual male crossdressers, I'm given to understand that the libido, or sexual desire, of CD's is, generally, lower than average. It would seem that it comes with the territory and is a salient feature of GID.

I don't mean to question CJ, but is this true? Is this fairly common? This comes into play in our house and has thrown me for a loop quite a bit. I've been around enough to know that my guy's libido is, on average, significantly lower than average, and way lower than mine. It also seems to cycle more than any previous non-CDing men I've been with - when the urge to dress comes on, his sexual interest in me is pretty much gone for a while - like a week or more. He "says" he's "always" interested, but in actuality he will put me off if I make advances when his mind is "elsewhere".

-g(so)

Just the reverse here. Mine is pretty high, my wife not so much. I'm always shocked when my wife talks about one of her friends who's husbane turns it down. I would think sex drive and crossdressing arn't really related.

Ummmm, not to brag or anything, but based upon my experience with Virginia, CJ's statement - and Georgia's experience with her CD (or Jill's with her wife) - definitely does NOT apply in our relationship. If anything, we have found that our sexual desire for each other is very high!! WHEW!!

Neither of us has noticed any decreased libido/sexual desire in B or Virginia, nor does it 'increase' while Virginia is present (for those that would presume being "dressed" is a sexual turn-on). The sexual desire Virginia, B, and I have for each other has absolutely nothing to do with whether it's Virginia or B who is 'present' at any given moment. It does have everything to do with the fact that we are completely in love with and wholly accept each other (and ourselves) for who we are, and making love with/to that other person is just another way of our expressing those emotions.

I would go even further to offer the suggestion that maybe the reason why there appears to be a lower-than-average libido/sexual desire of CD's in general is because the CD has not yet fully accepted - and come to love - this aspect of their person, which will affect their relationship with other people, too. On the other hand, the CD may not be in a relationship with someone who is totally supportive of (or completely in love with) the CD - the man and the woman. I do acknowledge there can be many more factors involved that lend toward a lowered libido that have absolutely nothing to do with being CD, and those may not have been taken into account when the research was being done on CDs in general.

Just my opinion, so please don't take me to the woodshed!!



- SL

Hi all,

Yes, Georgia, it would appear that this is the case more often than not. To be fair, it's more often the case in transgendered individuals who have strong leanings towards the transsexual end of the spectrum (without, mind you, necessarily being transsexual). Also, a loss of sex drive can be a strong symptom of clinical depression (not surprising that depression lurks in individuals who feel they have no place to "be" in the world).

If you search reputable online sexology and psychology sites, you'll discover many papers, studies, and discussions about transvestism and sex drive. Even though many of these relate more specifically to the effects of hormone therapy on libido, it's possible to find information that has little to do with such therapy.

By the way, and while I'm at it, here is just one journal that I find is chockfull of sound research and information.

The International Journal of Transgenderism

On a personal note, such is the case with myself, as well. My own sex drive is probably lower than average. However, as I have for other facets of my personality, I've come to accept this about myself and do not feel less worthy as a person because of it. Of course, I'm now partnered to a (very loving) SO; therefore, negotiations regarding the, uh, frequency of relations is inevitable. It's difficult to make a partner understand that a lower-than-average libido does not equal sexual non-interest in that partner... even though this may be what it looks like. There are just certain things about physiological responses we have little control over... Viagra notwithstanding.

SilverLady,

I totally agree with you. If there's even a shadow of a doubt that one's sexual partner is non-accepting of one's sexuality, then, yes, one's libido will suffer a decline. This is just common sense.

Love,
CJ

You ain't seen nuttin yet!!! You, wild, wonderful, witchy woman you!!!
Virginia
PS thanks for keeping our private life, well .............. what the heck, I love it!!!!! WE love it!!!!!!!!!!!!
Keepin the faith!

and it is spelled EPIPHANY - and you keep giving them to me!!!!

Hello everyone,

Libido really is one of those words,I call a trouble making word in our relationship.From the start Marie told me that she had a low libido,and because of my personality,I thought you have been alone for so long...I will teach you how to reconnect with your sexuality.Tantra sex,massage,music,the right smells in the room etc helped a little,my frustration was however as the years passed was that it was I that was instigating sexual contact.Frequency was far between,however that was o.k by me.....my biggest hurdle and I think many women have this hurdle is that I gaged my own sexuality on how my partner reacted by being stimulated etc...he can't be interested ,he does'nt even make the first move etc...as I would class my libido as average to high...I spent many nights facing the window with tears streaming down my face.

My spouse and I have been together for 14 years...he is not a crossdresser and we together are accepting his transexuality,depression as CJ said .Depression that has ben surging within my spouse for almost 30 years,this depression has led him to doubt himself as person,to not love himself for who he is etc..
So the last 5 months have been extremely stressfyu,but the flip side of the coin is that Marie is being totally honest with me,and though at times the honesty has shattered me...I now have the answers to many unanswered questions.
One of those is that the act of sex is not appealing to him.....mainly as he has the mindset of a female,and this does get complicated...Marie is hetrosexual,but having the mindset of a female has complicated things in regard of making love to me a GG.
I totally agree with Silverlady,that for one to be free with another,one needs to have acceptance of themselves.
I also agree that chemistry within the body needs to be at it's normal levels to also participate in not just lovemaking, but also carry out daily tasks etc.

The mind is very powerful and sometimes when we don't have the power within to see ourselves in our true sense but as an illusion...we can't be whole,and that power within us is controlled by the darkness that creates our illusion.

I know my spouse loves me and through my partners love...I have also learn't to love myself and to realise that though we may not have sex as frequently or if ever...it does not mean that I am not attractive,or that he does not love me.

Hugs Penny

I don't think it's so much of a CD issue, as it could be an issue of:
age;
weight;
health;
fantasy;
new fetish;

boredom;
masterbation;
tired of being the agressor;
etc.

I imagine the change in libido is no different, percentage wise, for CDs as compared to non-CDs.

got to agree with the idea that cdr's sex drive is probably lower than average, nad to be honest I see it come up in posts all the time. it is also one of the subjects that come up in PM's and Emails to me on a regular basis.

I really do agree with CJ, the more the leaning toward transsexuality the more the libido suffers.

I am transexual, and whilst I find that emotionally I find sex with women extremely satisfying, physically I feel wrong and at times "dirty". I do on rare occassions find that sex with men has the opposite effect, physically somewhat satisfying but emotionally totally "dirty".

My libido has been mentioned in a number of breakups with girlfriends as has the quality of the sex. Being physically disjointed from the actual act it is rather unsatisfying for my partneres, whilst they find the actual foreplay and post coital affection more than satifying.

I guess at the end of the day I am just uncomfortable with the body that nature gave to me and find it hard to enjoy something I find quite foreign to me. At this point in time I haven't had sexual contact with anyone for over 2 years and don't miss it at all. What I do miss is the feeling of being close to someone, just holding them, falling asleep in their embrace, assured that in the morning they will still be there, emotionally and physically. In that sense I have a high drive, but for the physical aspect I could take it or leave it.

Cathii

I have been told by several doctors that my sex drive is still WAY above normal. Always has been and has not slowed up yet. But that is just me.


Tiffy

Hi all,
From a biological, zoological and evolutionary standpoint, we, i.e. Homo sapiens, are not really supposed to live much beyond the age of 30. By that point, we have passed our peak of sex drive. This is the drive for procreation, and the pleasurable aspects of that activity act as a positive reinforcement. This drive is developed with normal growth and under the guidance of the particular balance of hormones our genes have endowed to us. Beyond that age, we are superfluous, and continue our lives as a result of our intelligence and creativity. My point is that beyond this peak of reproductive frenzy, behavior patterns can go wild and out of control of physiological, i.e., endocrine, factors. Our behavior becomes totally unrelated to the survival of the species, although in the long run it could result in our extinction.
The examples of cross-dressing, trans-sexual behavior, may be the manifestations of this behavioral chaos. Libido or sex drive may be nominally under control of hormones, but a multitude of environmental factors take over after the procreative period is past. Note the frequent observation that in our youth, the contact with female clothing is sexually arousing, but that correlation wanes with age. This lowered physiological control could account for the huge variability in the degree of cross-dressing and sexual activity among the individuals in our group.
Many of us, even including professional psychologists, have wrestled with the question of why do we do it? Where does this CD compulsion originate? We can describe it. We can offer the comfort or tension-release we get from it. But the basic reasons escape us. Is it possible that the behavior release and chaos is responsible. I do not offer this as an answer, but as a way of thinking about our particular situation. Perhaps a different way of looking at what Virginia calls our “Magical Mystery Tour.”

Hugs,

Lydia

If we consider that the most erotic organ of the body is the mind, then it only makes sense that our libido can be affected by not only the social baggage attached to unusual gender issues as well as any biological stuff that accompanies such things.

And of course there is all sorts of self esteem, depression and the like.

This might be a good place to remember that CDs are represented in above average numbers in places like the military and probably in conservative religious circles and so on. Our minds trying to over compensate for something, can play lots of tricks on us.

From personal experience I can say that although my libido was pretty high for much of my life, it was extremely affected by my mood and feelings towards situations and people. For me, lack of desire was sometimes the ultimate passive agressive response even as it was something I thought I did not want.

I have to say that somewhere however there is a connection between a lot of my feelings about my sexuality, my responses, and feelings towards women generally and my CDing. And sometimes it is a very angry and confusing maze. I could spend a very long time trying to sort all this out in myself, let alone anyone else.

Absaroka

2cents from the peanut gallery.

My libido hit the dirt 2 or 3 years ago. That and some other events kind of conspired as it were that allowed me to finally recognize I AM a CD.
What with all that hormone stuff no longer cluttering my system, life is much easier. I can be girl or boy, though there are times I feel like neither or both. Can make deciding what to wear problematic tho on those days.
Actual sex doesnt seem to have anything to do with anything anymore.
What a load off!

Sylvia H

I'm very sorry, but my libido is very strong, maybe I'm very over sexed, I'm not sure. I love my wife, I wish that she could come on board with me but I deal with it on a daily basis. I am working very hard on this issue.

Hi all,

Absaroka wrote: This might be a good place to remember that CDs are represented in above average numbers in places like the military and probably in conservative religious circles and so on. Our minds trying to over compensate for something, can play lots of tricks on us.

I agree. Just as, according to Malcolm the mathematician in Jurassic Park, "life will always find a way" (presumably, to express or actualize itself), so, too, will libidinal energy. Libido is one of the central drives that inhabit human beings; it's very much welded to our survival instinct. If, for whatever reasons, it finds no outlet in our actual sexual behaviours, libidinal energy will be sublimated, i.e., diverted in some way from its direct goal, into some other (often, more socially acceptable) behaviour where it will have a chance to dissipate.

The case has been made, for example, that religious mystics subconsciously focus their libidinal energy in their quest for a closeness to the godhead (Hindu bhakti-yoga or the soul as a "bride of Christ" and all that). Another example: military careers as devotion to country, the only beloved that matters. Here, too, it's been theorized, libido is sublimated in the service of some higher aim.

It's important to realize that libido, in the sense that Freud first used the term, is only incidentally related to actual sexual behaviours. The drive, the push from within, matters more than does its outcome in the world.

Now, as for transgender libido, I have an idea--borne out by much of what I've read over the years--that CD's have a lower-than-average libido because they naturally resist going in the direction their sexuality wants to head. This resistance is culturally determined; if a sexual behaviour is proscribed (or, at the very least, frowned upon) by the culture, that part of the conscious mind that seeks harmony with other individuals and society (what Freud called the super-ego) kicks into high gear and tries to scuttle the behaviour before it even occurs. Purges, for example, can be seen as a (probably temporary) victory of a CD's super-ego over his own sexual urges. A low libido could be seen as this same process in action, but over time, as opposed to cycles of purges and purchases.

In a way, we're constantly at war with ourselves. Like every other person, we want fullness in our admittedly unconventional sexuality but are unwilling (or, in most cases, unable) to pay the price... that price being the flounting of the social mores that gave rise to our personality and character, with all the negative consequences we know such flounting can entail. We're at war with ourselves because those around us view some part of us as somehow defective or unworthy or disdainful. Our sexuality is, precisely, that part of us. Therefore, we try to stifle it. The result: a low libido or, as mentioned above, a sublimated libido.

Mind you, all this only works if we view crossdressing as being linked to our sexuality. Many will deny that this is the case. They'll see sexuality and sexual expression as divorced from the biological datum of engenderedness (whether or not this engenderedness is transgressive). When people say that "gender is between the ears," they're not referring to the brain, but to the mind. I cannot help but feel that this denial (of the link between sexual and gender expressions) is also the super-ego at work... the rationale being that, if we're not responsible for our own behaviour (i.e., if our behaviour is strictly a matter of physiologically deterministic developments), we cannot (or should not) be judged upon it.

I'd rather take a different path and suggest that, perhaps, the social mores currently in vogue are never (and can never be) the be-all and end-all of moral yardsticks when it comes to human sexuality. The fact that, throughout history, and across cultures, room has been made, more or less, for those whose gender identity (and sexuality) is unconventional gives credence to this idea. That our own culture--with its origins in patriarchal traditions--makes so little room for transgendered people doesn't in the least invalidate this.

Low libido, I think, is (or can be, in specific cases) the consequence of a mind at war with itself. This is but an assumption, but I'm supposing that those who can fully accept and enjoy their sexuality or their own sexual being likely have little to complain about when it comes to their sex drive. Of course, as Jean-Paul Sartre once said, "l'Enfer, c'est les autres" ("Hell is other people."); I'd be hard-pressed to find anyone on God's green earth who can accept and love themselves as they are while everyone else around them reviles them.

We still have work to do, people. And I'm not talking mapping the human genome, here, stalking those pesky transgender genes. I mean not being afraid to show others that you value those very things that make you the specific person you are. And, by extension, that you value same in others... regardless of their libido.

Love,
CJ