Secrets

[Babbs]

Secrets are heavy, secrets are burdensome, secrets are time consuming, secrets are difficult, secrets are misleading, but my secret is mine till I'm ready to share with the one I love without hurting her.

[Anthony Simon]

It doesn't seem terribly likely that it's ever going to not hurt your SO. Just the issue of "why didn't you trust me?" means that.

[Babbs]

or why did you deceive me....that's scary

[Noeleena]

Hi,

To hold or hide a secret from the one you love means a lack of trust in that person and can be you lack confidence or you have self doubt in your self, and lack confidence in yourself to stand being very open to others, and shows a weakness in your makeup, and who you are as a person,

What is better be open in all things in your self or hide behind a wall that will one day fall down any way and you are then seen for who you really are,

remember nothing is hidden that wont be open at some stage, being open and honist is still the best way, even if only for peace of mind,

...noeleena...

[Babbs]

Valid points but not all true. We all have things we want private on many matters and to keep those to yourself ( a secret) does not necessarily imply a weakness in oneself. There can be a multitude of reason to keep matters private other than lacking self confidence. It could be to protect others, for your own enjoyment, whatever. But when you make the decision to share a secret I feel its best to be aware of all the ramifications of doing so and not be selfish and go full bore.

[Absaroka]

Most secrets contain a second secret, namely the lie that there is no secret. Sometimes the first step is to admit that there is a secret, but that you are not going to share it.

I used this a couple of times when I was in therapy. My wife would often ask me what was discussed and eventually began to ask me not to tell her so much of what was discussed, but now and then I'd just say that I didn't want to tell her. She would be curious, but was mostly able to accept that we all have the right to a few secrets.

[Noeleena]

Hi,

I took it as to this is between only the two people concerned no one out side of that, so is this just between one man and one woman in a marrage and every detail i was talking about refered to that.

A house divided against its self will fall if you have a secret room and your partner can not enter then there will be ?s and you wont answer, that implys a lack of trust on your part and a lack of trust of your partner in you, well can

The weakness i was meaning is if i can not open that door to my secret room i am weak, i become strong when i face my room and open my door, to my partner, because she will go with me into my room im not alone any more, with my withheld secret room /

I may and have done with held info from others or i may not comment on a matter, because its not mine to give and yes im in that position as a member of our group and its with in our commitee and concerns 10 of us, i can not say what that matter is , that is not what i meant ,

My relastionship with Jos was totaly different, we never had any secrets, ether of us, never with held any thing.

any way if Jos had with held any thing from me i would have known as it was 3 years ago she did i knew about it, and after two weeks Jos said she had something to tell me . i said i allready know,
What im saying is you know each other so well , well we did,

...noeleena...

[Anita]

It's still my opinion that keeping a secret is not a passive activity. My own experience is that it takes active energy on one's part. If that's so for others, then that is part of the reason that older CDers and trans folk find themselves wanting to stop hiding--as their energy level lowers with age, they can feel the toll that secret-keeping is demanding from them.

[Kelly]

Hmmmmm.......

Lots of philosophical undertones for me in this thread. I deal with the dilemmas almost daily.

Let's get one thing straight. A secret is not a lie. A secret is a truth you choose not to share. A lie is a falsehood you promote as a truth. [don't go running off to dictionary.com, those are my own operational definitions].

There is nothing wrong with a secret in an of itself. Since it involves individual choice and last I checked, choice comes hand in hand with free will. Importantly, there is no deception. The only burden is a self imposed guilt derived from not sharing; choosing not to revel a truth. I you are like most anybody else, dear, you have lots of indiscretions (hopefully minor) to feel guilty about. Try not to invent any that you don't deserve. You don't deserve guilt feelings for keeping a secret.

Now, when a lie is fabricated to protect a secret, that is where the real burden it taken on. Here is the deception; the guilt feeling is legitimate. The tangled web is weaved.

So, what are the options? Well, it is either share the secret or not.

If you keep the secret, then you have to avoid lying. However guarded the closet is, it needs to become tighter. Future gender explorations will be fewer and farther between; fleeting at best. Your relationship or mental health may suffer. Or, provided you throw off the self-imposed guilt yoke, it may be just fine for you.

If you share the secret. Then the closet has to become large enough for two. Read this histories on this forum to see the possible outcomes. For some it has been a disaster, for others it has been wonderful, for still others it is somewhere between. For you, it is hard to predict.

I wish you the very best.

Kelly.

[Davita]

Thanks Kelly, That was pretty clear and concise.

[KimberlyS]

Babbs, a short post but such a lot in it. I see two major things with in it. First you feel that your CDing is a heavy burdensome secret, and second that you see there is a need to tell the one you love.

To address the first one I can only state how I have dealt with it. For me I have come to realize that my CDing is not some deep dark secret that is bad and I do not want anyone else to know about. In my path to self acceptance I have come to learn my CDing is not some deep dark skeleton in my closet that I can not let anyone else see. It is just a more person trait about me that I am more choosy who I share with. My CDing is just something that I do not let everyone know about. There are many things about us that we do not shout out to everyone around us and feel a need to share all of the details about. Who I share my femme side with I am sure will change and evolve, but I am no longer weigh down with a deep dark heavy secret I need to keep.

For the second part I applaud you that you see a need to tell your close loved one of your CDing. For the second part of this one "without hurting her" I will tell you this will most likely not happen. In most cases if not very close to all, there is going to be some hurt happening here. You have with held what you are seeing now as an important trait within your self from her. There is going to be some doubt and trust issues. What else have you not told her and shared with her? There will be many things going through her mind that hopefully the two of you will be able to talk about. I will say one key thing and that is in most cases you are better to tell her then her to find out. So I am not saying run up to her and blurt it out but do not wait for the perfect time to tell her as it will never come.

I wish you the best down your path of self acceptance and telling your loved one. And they do not have to be separate paths.

kimberlys - cd
joe in a skirt

[Babbs]

Thank you all for your input and understanding! I know there will be a time soon I will share this with my wife. I know this because i want to do it. My joining this forum is my first step. Thank you all again!

[Anne Bonny]

I am like an onlooker arriving late to a code that is being well handled. Like Kelly's response.

Within a marriage there are no secrets all should be fully known...in not disclosing this part of who you are you have deceived your wife and in doing so have broken the trust that is a very cherished thing in a marriage. The longer you have practiced this deception the worse the damage to the trust that exists in your marriage.

Unfortunately the truth is for most all people, though times they are a changin' hiding the fact that you are a transvestite is a really big deal! That's a bad thing. In your wife's mind you lied and have been unfaithful worse - to her - it is an infidelity and you are the other woman, you have been unfaithful by having an affair all be it with yourself it is a breech, and if you have lied about this how can she ever trust you that you are not lying about other things? This is a woman's viewpoint, that viewpoint of a wife (or of a husband who is told by his wife she is a crossdresser FTM) - know that is kind of a ridiculous thought but put yourself in her shoes - no wait! keep your own shoes on!!!

She will ask herself..."Self? What have I married into!? He lied to me! I would have never married or even been interested in him if I knew he was a pervert!! ewe!!!" Cringing she will be disgusted and extremely white-hot angry with you. Liar!! Pervert!! Why don't you go find a man!? Why don't you go cut it off!? Bastard!!!! I'm not good enough for you?? You lied to me!! Get the hell out of here!!

Yeah...lots of thoughts will be spinning around, lots of questions and what happens in that bubbling brew inside your lovely wife's head and the eventual outcome depends on alot of things that cannot be predicted. How long have you been married? Has it been a good marriage? Have you been fully committed to each other? Does she know you thoroughly? Do you have a deep deep commitment to each other and to your marriage? This is where you are when you decide to disclose to your wife after x number of years...oh...by the way..."I'm a transvestite and I like to pleasure myself!" No that is not a small thing, perhaps your thing will be rather small and withered as you are pondering and anxious fearing your entire marriage may be blown to hell, your "secret" may be disclosed to family and friends by a very angry spouse!

Now if your marriage your love for each other and your commitment and devotion to each other and to your marriage is strong and has been through the years - I would think this improves your chances that your marriage will survive. You will of course be having to provide many answers and clarifications and assurances and be willing to go along honestly with her decision on how all of this is to be handled - the rules and conditions she will make to how things are gonna be from now on. That can range from fine, I love you anyway, to get the hell out! To you are to throw every female item out and you are never to dress this way again in or out of my presence (unrealistic and not happening I know). Or..She may say don't dress when I am around and you are not to go out in public or dress around anyone. Who knows the process is long and varied - the main thing is to assure her I am the same man you married and have known, I am the same as I have always been, I just have this restless desire tormenting me inside. No I am not homosexual, no I do not want a sex change. Whatever....That's my input which is my standard advice on disclosures that comes from my personal experience when I disclosed this to my wife 7 years into our 22 year marriage and still going though I consider our marriage ended as a marriage relationship a couple years ago when my wife's mind was horribly and permanently altered and is still declining today due to Alzheimer's dementia which started for her at about age 49 (early onset).

[Gillian]

Let's get one thing straight. A secret is not a lie. A secret is a truth you choose not to share. A lie is a falsehood you promote as a truth. [don't go running off to dictionary.com, those are my own operational definitions].

There is nothing wrong with a secret in an of itself. Since it involves individual choice and last I checked, choice comes hand in hand with free will. Importantly, there is no deception. The only burden is a self imposed guilt derived from not sharing; choosing not to revel a truth. I you are like most anybody else, dear, you have lots of indiscretions (hopefully minor) to feel guilty about. Try not to invent any that you don't deserve. You don't deserve guilt feelings for keeping a secret.

I appreciate the the thoughts on the difference between the words. Secrets are choosing not to reveal the truth to someone, but why? As the old comment runs, "honey do I look fat in these jeans", what is to be gained, or lost by answering this question one way or the other. Does anyone ever fully tell their spouse about all the sorted details of their relationships before they met? Does full disclosure really do anything more than what giving loose storys about any old relationship does?

Now, when a lie is fabricated to protect a secret, that is where the real burden it taken on. Here is the deception; the guilt feeling is legitimate. The tangled web is weaved.

The problem with lies is that they are difficult to keep straight in your mind! The truth is much easier to remember. What I find interesting in all of this is how much the concept of what truth is has changed in resent years. By example;
1. Jack Nicholson's character says in the movie Something's Gotta Give, "I always told you some version of the truth", causes me to think that we live in a world where secrets are ever present, and we have versions of said truth to hide these secrets.
2. There is a well known north american religious cult that I am taking a quote from one of there own magazines, "you only have to tell the truth to those who deserve to hear it". So who gets to determine who hears the truth, and what are the secrets being kept, and from whom?
3. I save the best until last. If we had to go to court to testify, we are told to sware to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Yet the very lawyers who listen to these oaths, are twisting their questions to extract only the information that they want the court to hear.

The truth is usually the first victim while someone is keeping secrets!

To keep secrets is one thing, how they are kept is another. To use an old WW2 expression, "loose lips, sink ships", reminds us how we have to be careful who we tell our secrets to. Then there is an old proverb, "even a fool is thought to be wise if they keep their mouth closed", reminds us that to say nothing is the best way to keep a secret!

If you share the secret. Then the closet has to become large enough for two. Read this histories on this forum to see the possible outcomes. For some it has been a disaster, for others it has been wonderful, for still others it is somewhere between. For you, it is hard to predict.

It would have been difficult to keep a war time secret if you lived on the dock where you saw the ships set sail daily. The closer to the razors edge you sit, the greater the chances of getting cut. So the next question is, "do I move away from the edge, or make the closet bigger?" Can anyone keep a secret forever? Can anyone hide the truth forever?

[Carol Esme]

Well the secret to a continuing relationship is the timing. I spent the best part of 25 years hiding my real self from my wife. I'd given her the truth early on but she didn't like it so I hid it. Now we are a couple of years into trying to find a way to live with the truth. I'm retired, the kids have left the nest and it's possible, before it wouldn't have been. Only you can judge when the timing is right.