Motivations for crossdessing

[Kay(SO)]

Julie,
I had to stick my nose in here and make one comment.

You wrote: In the past when I referred to my femme self I would use terms like 'my other half' or 'I have a split personality' or pronouns like 'she' and 'her'. But I have recently come to the realization that Julie IS me.

My two cents: This is the reason my husband doesn't feel the need to use a femme name. He's still him. And to CD'rs here, I would like to say that part of my ability to accept and support my husband's CDing, is that he made sure I knew it is still him underneath the wrappings. I'm grateful that he doesn't see himself as separate and I'm also beyond grateful that he doesn't feel the need to have a femme name. I do not call him "her" or a "gurl" and I will never. He's not a "she/her". He's a man who enjoys expressing his feminine self. That I can deal with.

Kay(SO)

[Virginia]

Kay, thanks for your input. You GG's have a great perspective on us.
According to Carl Jung, some CD'er never achieve the "narvana"" on CD'ing, assuming that all things are equal. That is they don't go on pills and then go 24/7 or the SRS. Anyway, Jung says that there a feminine personna in a "true"CD'er and if the Cd'er realizes this and is successful in merging the male and female personnas then the sum of each produces a whole that is greater than either of the previous parts. This is not to say a total personality change, but the "anima" as Jung describes the "surpressed" female attributes usually produces changes in the male attributes that make him more caring, compassionate, giving. loving and he reduces his aggressive tendencies. That is the "gift" that Cd'ing can produce. It is a kinder,more loving, gentler person that can emerge. There is for some of us, a lot more to CD'ing than just the desire to wear clothing of the opposite sex. It is an emerging of something beautiful that if properly developed and nurtured benefits all that come in contact with this "new" person. It does not mean your spouse will suddenly wake up one morning and be someone new. For most it is a trial and error journey. But, just being aware that these changes are possible and nurturing them will, by God's grace be the gift that keeps on giving.
Just my 2 cents worth!?
Love,
Deborah

[Caroline]

My two cents: This is the reason my husband doesn't feel the need to use a femme name. He's still him. And to CD'rs here, I would like to say that part of my ability to accept and support my husband's CDing, is that he made sure I knew it is still him underneath the wrappings. I'm grateful that he doesn't see himself as separate and I'm also beyond grateful that he doesn't feel the need to have a femme name. I do not call him "her" or a "gurl" and I will never. He's not a "she/her". He's a man who enjoys expressing his feminine self. That I can deal with.

Kay(SO)

Hello Kay,

First, I'd just like to say that whatever works for you and your husband is fine. I respect that. Normally when people say that, they mean the opposite, but I really do mean it. In any event, what others do and think is often irrelevant when it comes to working out our own modus-vivendi.

Second, I'd just like to add a few observations about my own motivations, in the vain hope that they might be of interest to someone.

I don't really know why I dress-up; neither does any psychiatrist! And, yes, I have heard of Carl Jung, and read him extensively, but in the final analysis all he had was a theory, no matter how plausible he made it.

Neither Jung, nor Freud, nor Adler, nor any ot the others whose names I've forgotten, have offered more than a theory on the subject. The trouble with theories, however, is that the more they're retold, the more concrete they become to the teller, until the point is reached where the teller believes implicitly in the 'story' he is telling. But the concretizing of a theory into 'fact' doesn't make it empirically true!

Sure, I can give you lots of explanations why I CD, but how relevant is that?. Believe me when I say I've explained in the same exhaustive detail to 4 different psychiatrists now, 2 of whom were eminent in their field, but none of them was able to give a definitive answer to the question 'Why?', so how can I be expected to do so?

The most honest of the 4, and the most useful, had the integrity to say that the 'Why?' was irrelevant. He was an advocate of Cognitive Behavioural Therapy, the main purpose of which is to make one feel better about how one actually is. OK, I know this method has limited application when it comes to mass-murderers and the like, but we're hardly in that league, are we?

Anyway, the reason I wanted to know 'Why?' was mainly because of society's disapprobation of my CDing, and I mean 'society' in both the micro and macro sense. In other words, I really only feel bad about it because of the reaction I would engender in others who did not, or do not, share my needs or beliefs.

In the UK, we have The Beaumont Society, to visit,click here: http://www.beaumontsociety.org.uk/ whom I contacted many years ago for help. Up to that time, I'd never had a femme name, nor seen the need for one. After all, like your husband, Kay, I'm still me, whether dressed in a frock or not. However, joining Beaumont meant that my 'secret' was being made public, albeit to a supporting and sharing group of people, which increased the risk of exposure, ridicule, job-loss, and all sorts of other unpleasant consequences. Hence the adoption of a femme name became a necessary subterfuge, behind which I could hide my real name, and protect myself from exposure.

Since adopting my femme name for 'security' reasons, I have subsequently grown into it. By that I mean it just seemed silly to be standing around fully dressed en femme, wig, make-up, etc., and being called Fred. So now, when I'm dressed, I call myself by my femme name,even though I have no illusions that I'm still anything other than Fred, nor do I want to be anything other than what I am.

Incidentally, one useful feature of having a femme name is that my wife can say things like, "D'you think Caroline wolud like that?" when we're looking round clothes shops, without causing either of us any embarassment.

Now I know I've overstayed my welcome. Sorry, everyone, for taking up so much of your time.

Kind regards, and take care,

Caroline.

[Kay(SO)]

Caroline,

I agree that what works for us may not work for everyone. My point was to let people in to the fact that to some of us GG's it doesn't make sense or might be uncomfortable. After talking with many, many SO's, this has been my experience and I just wanted to share it.

I found your post interesting. I haven't really shared about my views on the "why" because I know that there is no explanation or reason. I learned a long time ago that it's one of those things that just "is". Oddly enough, I am a Cognitive Behaviroal Therapist.

I do understand about the security issues and it makes sense that you would want to use an alias. I guess one more thing I'm thinking though is this. If you have self-acceptance and acceptance by your SO, then why the need to refer to "Caroline" when shopping? I would think that your wife could just say, "hey, do you like this?" That's what I do and neither of us is embarrassed by it. Again, what works for us, doesn't apply to everyone else. Possibly no one else for that matter.

Kay(SO)

[Loretta Ann]

I guess it is time I inserted my two cents worth into this conversation.

Caroline wrote; The trouble with theories, however, is that the more they're retold, the more concrete they become to the teller, until the point is reached where the teller believes implicitly in the 'story' he is telling. But the concretizing of a theory into 'fact' doesn't make it empirically true!

Well that statement may be true for some, the concretizing of a theory into 'fact' only happens when it becomes my reality. In my situation I arrived at the place that Jung states we should be without ever having heard of the Jung theory. All that Jung did for me was to reaffirm that where I was at was where I should be.

IMO we can all use that kind of confirmation no matter how different we are from each other.

[Karen Marie]

all of you are so inciteful.
again i see that none of us is the same.i'm starting to realize that
there are as many reasons we crossdress as there are stars in the
sky.for myself i have my femme name because many times i feel that
is who i am.ever since i can remember,i've identified with girls.all of my
close friends were girls,and even today my close friends are women.it's
where i feel comfortable.i've given up wanting to know why.i have accept
ed who i am and i am happy with me. i am just so impressed with all
of you.you're the best. bunches of hugs,
karen.

[Sally]

I'm a firm believer that there is sufficient medical scientific evidence available these days to substantiate to a degree the fact that it's a lie that all human beings are either of two exclusive biological sexes. This lie is clearly demonstrated by the existence of intersexuals and hermaphrodites at the big end of the spectrum and there exists also an untold mix of people on a lesser scale of the mixture of both genders.

The principle of 'Yin' and 'Yang' which teaches that there is never one aspect without the other in any being, demonstrates the Eastern beliefs which have been held for thousands of years. What makes us human beings is much more complex than our capacity to breed other human beings, but despite this we are taught from the first that we are either boys or girls and how we behave must conform and correspond with these roles. What if, as many reputable medical scientists believe, that our brain was wired before we learned to hear or speak, so that as we grow up, in our sub conscience we know these teachings are incorrect.

I believe our essential self is not real women or real men, it is being human and this means it is a being thing, not a doing thing. Our inner self dictates what we do, whether that conforms with what we are taught or not, nature has the last say. It gets back to the cat and the duck story. A duck can be raised with a litter of kittens and may emulate what the kittens do, but when the duck reaches its' age of maturity it's natural being takes over and it does duck things without thinking about it, e.g. flying, swimming etc, things a cat doesn't do. That is nature defying nurture.

We are taught from an early age that acting as the opposite sex is wrong and as we grow up we learn that indeed the majority of society harbours this belief, even if only outwardly, as I believe most people carry some stigma within them. But as we grow, nature endeavours to exert her influence and for many of us we are cut off from half of who we really are. I'm not denying that there is such a thing as male or female but I do know that people possess both kinds of energy and are capable of both roles and I believe it's not necessary to be one or the other or to be limited to only one set of gender behaviour and feelings, but this is what we are taught as to how it should be.

I also believe that the reason why women find it harder to comprehend and come to terms with that many men desire to portray a female image, is the fact that for the first six weeks of the life of a foetus it is a prototype female and if it is to be male it isn't until around the 6th week that it starts to turn into the male physical form. If the babe is to remain female then it doesn't undergo any changes so there is much less chance of anything 'going wrong'. As we know nature never works to the same receipe and along the way there are so many opportunities for things to 'go wrong', (hence on the larger scale, babies being born with the genitals of both sexes), and medical figures show that worldwide, there is an average of 1/100 babies born with some degree of physical sex ambiguity.

So, if there is documented evidence of these figures of babies born with an obvious 'difference' which is visible to the naked eye, then it is feasible that there are many, many more born with 'differences' which are not so severe or evident to the naked eye. Why else would we hear so many people from around the world, of all cultures, say the same thing in that from their earliest recollection they were drawn to emulate the opposite sex. There must be a higher force within us which dictates our feelings and behaviour no matter how firmly it is impregnated into our brain by our parents that boys do this and girls do that.

More proof is the fact that many babies are surgically altered soon after birth to fit with the assumptions of the medicos, who tamper with the evidence that nature doesn't make all humans clearly of one sex or the other. But when these children reach puberty many of them prove that the medicos got it horribly wrong and these teenagers live a terrible traumatic life struggling with having been brought up as the incorrect sex and gender and many seek to have medical science correct the process, often with very sad results.

Further proof is the fact that both men and women have testosterone and estrogen running thorugh their blood stream, only in different ratios, but as medical science proves, some men have a higher estrogen content than others and vice versa for women. Men make their own all womanly estrogen which is converted by their tissues from their all manly testosterone and once again, nature doesn't work to a set formula, not everyone's sytem works identically and the mix and ratio varies so markedly.

Well, this is a subject which one could write about for weeks, but what I have attempted to demonstrate is my belief that there are indeed documanted medical facts as to why some people behave, feel and identify to varying degrees with their opposite sex. My argument is that if nature creates people with such a high marked degree of variation which is visible to the naked eye, then it can be safely assumed that she creates many more people with lesser variations which are not visible to the naked eye, hence some peoples desire and need to identify to varying degrees with their opposite born biological sex.

I would admit that there is more than one reason why people crossdress and whatever the reason, knowing it will not effect what they do, one way or the other.

Aside from the biological functions of breeding for the survival of the species, being masculine or feminine has zilch to do with being biologically male or female. Hopefully one day our children will be educated to grow up with the knowledge and belief that nobody should be forced to live a lie just to appease those who have a belief that it is wrong to do this or that. As long as we hurt nobody, everybody should be free to live the life they desire or were meant to, but as we know, old habits die hard and it takes at least two generations to effect any major changes in long held beliefs and practices.

My Kindest Regards.

Sally.

[Amber(SO)]

I will admit to not truly understanding the "why"of why crossdressers do so. I agree that we all have the same hormones running through our bodies at different levels that make each of us have more male or female features. I don't really agree with:

I'm not denying that there is such a thing as male or female but I do know that people possess both kinds of energy and are capable of both roles and I believe it's not necessary to be one or the other or to be limited to only one set of gender behaviour and feelings, but this is what we are taught as to how it should be.

Teaching a child to be male or female has little to do with how they act. A man can be a great chef, interior decorator, or teacher...each considered "female" roles. A woman can be a great CEO, accountant, or physician...each considered "male" roles. So who is to say that dressing up in women's clothing, makeup, and a wig makes you more feminine?

This is turning the stereotype around on yourself, is it not? What is the need for dressing the part if you just want to feel feminine? Is taking a bubble bath with some champagne and soft music the same? Is it really the world stereotyping crossdressers, or are you doing it yourself, also?

If we are going to blame others for not accepting a third or fourth gender, perhaps we need to look at our own stereotyping of the world. Not everyone has a problem with crossdressing, but not every crossdresser is capable of accepting their own gender. It takes each of us to look at ourselves and others as human beings first. The gender issue is something that will be argued over for many generations. Maybe hermaphrodites have an advantage over the common XX or XY human, as long as they are not surgically altered before it's discovered what their true gender is.

Respectfully, Amber

[Loretta Ann]

Amber wrote; So who is to say that dressing up in women's clothing, makeup, and a wig makes you more feminine?

For me it doesn't It is meeting my needs to express who I really am. For someone who is not like us simply wearing the clothes would do nothing for them. The clothes do not make the person.

[Caroline]

I do understand about the security issues and it makes sense that you would want to use an alias. I guess one more thing I'm thinking though is this. If you have self-acceptance and acceptance by your SO, then why the need to refer to "Caroline" when shopping? I would think that your wife could just say, "hey, do you like this?" That's what I do and neither of us is embarrassed by it. Again, what works for us, doesn't apply to everyone else. Possibly no one else for that matter.

Kay(SO)

Hi Kay,

For a number of reasons, the most important of which is that my wife doesn't want anyone else to know about the CDing aspect of me, and referring to 'me' publicly in a pseudonomic way enables her to deal with it.

Another reason for using a femme name: my wife says to me things like, "Is Caroline going to visit tonight, I'd like to see her again". It makes it a game that both of us enjoy, and indulge in of our own free will.

And a third reason: probably like most kids I used to like pretending being someone else. You know, visit the pictures (you call them films), and all the kids came out swaggering pretending to be Hopalong Cassidy or the like--if he's too old for you, try John Wayne. Well, now I can pretend to be Caroline. It's great fun. I can also express parts of myself that I would have otherwise kept hidden. For example, do you think I could express myself so freely here if I wasn't using a pseudonymous name and e-mail address?

However, in the final analysis, it is all down to what works for you as a couple, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Kind regards, and take care,

Caroline.

[Caroline]

All that Jung did for me was to reaffirm that where I was at was where I should be.

IMO we can all use that kind of confirmation no matter how different we are from each other.

Hi Darlene,

You are so right..we all look for, and need, some kind of confirmation. That, too, is part of the human psyche; it is also a sociological imperative, which binds us together in groups and societies.

Whatever works for you is fine.

Kind regards,

Caroline.

[Kay(SO)]

This is a topic that could go on and on. Because we all have different opinions or beliefs. It's interesting that's for sure. Just a few comments.

Sally wrote: I also believe that the reason why women find it harder to comprehend and come to terms with that many men desire to portray a female image, is the fact that for the first six weeks of the life of a foetus it is a prototype female and if it is to be male it isn't until around the 6th week that it starts to turn into the male physical form. If the babe is to remain female then it doesn't undergo any changes so there is much less chance of anything 'going wrong'.

I'm not sure if I read this right. However, I do know that many women aren't even aware that the fetus starts out female. Truthfully, I'm an educated, intelligent woman who gave birth to twins and I had never heard that until my husband's gender therapist told me. It's not something taught in health class, biology (high school or college) or childbirth classes. At least when I went to school. Anyway, I can tell you from my own experience and from the hoards of women I associate with, this has NOTHING to do with why we have difficulty comprehending or coming to terms with the fact that our SO's desire to portray a female image.

Sally also wrote: As long as we hurt nobody

I'm sure you were referring to physical harm. It does however bother me when I read this statement (which is all too often). It's a matter of perspective. If it didn't hurt anybody, then why are there so many wives who either can't deal with it, leave, etc... This again shows me that there is still so little understanding about the range of emotions, turmoil, confusion and yes, even pain for the SO who finds out or is told that he husband is a CD'r. To negate the fact that it does hurt people on a mental and emotional level wouldn't be right. I do realize that we as SO's can either learn to accept it, grow from the experience, try to find the positives, or get out of the relationship. What stinks is that we are put in this position to begin with. Having to do all of the above is no easy task. And I'm not saying that it's anyone's fault. Just pointing out that there needs to be understanding. Those of us who stay and make the decision to commit to our relationships do it because we love our men, no matter what. We love who you were when we fell in love the first time and we do everything we can to love all of you, feminine self and all.

Do I really care about all of the medical and scientific reasons or theories for WHY my husband is a crossdresser? No, it doesn't matter because I'm too busy trying to figure out how/where it fits into our lives. I'm too wrapped up in how I'm going to feel one minute to the next when it comes to experiencing the CDing. The "why" is irrelevant at this point. I realize that my honesty is sometimes not appreciated here but I can only be true to myself and my feelings and this is the place I feel safest to express those feelings. Thanks for letting me share,

Kay(SO)

[Kay(SO)]

Caroline,

Now I understand better where you and your wife are coming from and it makes sense to me. We also do that and I hadn't thought of it. When we travel, we both dress up and I get to pretend that I'm someone else and it's quite fun. I'm not the therapist, mother, wife, etc... I just get to be me. I get it! There's an element of mystery, intrigue and thrill to it for me just like it is for you and my husband. Thanks for making me think!

Hugs,

Kay(SO)

[Amber(SO)]

I think Kay has said exactly what most wives/SOs go through:

If it didn't hurt anybody, then why are there so many wives who either can't deal with it, leave, etc... This again shows me that there is still so little understanding about the range of emotions, turmoil, confusion and yes, even pain for the SO who finds out or is told that he husband is a CD'r. To negate the fact that it does hurt people on a mental and emotional level wouldn't be right. I do realize that we as SO's can either learn to accept it, grow from the experience, try to find the positives, or get out of the relationship. What stinks is that we are put in this position to begin with. Having to do all of the above is no easy task. And I'm not saying that it's anyone's fault. Just pointing out that there needs to be understanding. Those of us who stay and make the decision to commit to our relationships do it because we love our men, no matter what. We love who you were when we fell in love the first time and we do everything we can to love all of you, feminine self and all.

It's hard to put into words when you don't want to hurt the person who has finally been honest with you. On the one hand you are appreciative of the fact that the lies are over. On the other hand, you don't want to hurt their feelings, now that they have been honest. That in itself gets some of us in trouble. We accept it when we are told...then the shock sets in a few months later. You're torn between being honest about your feelings and hurting the one you love, or bottling it up inside, like they have about the CDing for years, to keep from hurting/losing you. There is no easy way out.

All I can say is that you have had years to come to grips with your own CDing. We need time to adjust to it too.

Amber

[Caroline]

Caroline,

Now I understand better where you and your wife are coming from and it makes sense to me. We also do that and I hadn't thought of it. When we travel, we both dress up and I get to pretend that I'm someone else and it's quite fun. I'm not the therapist, mother, wife, etc... I just get to be me. I get it! There's an element of mystery, intrigue and thrill to it for me just like it is for you and my husband. Thanks for making me think!

Hugs,

Kay(SO)

Dear Kay,

It is me who owes you thanks for making me think, and trying to express myself clearly.

I would also like to repond to your immediately preceding post, in particular this quote:" I realize that my honesty is sometimes not appreciated here but I can only be true to myself and my feelings and this is the place I feel safest to express those feelings. Thanks for letting me share."

I appreciate your honesty, Kay, and I would hope that everyone else here would too, even if at times you may say something that is not agreed with or liked, necessarily. I hope you will continue to be forthright and honest, and I feel privileged that you are prepared to share your feelings with me.

I think that honesty and integrity are vitally important attributes in a relationship. Without them, there can be no trust, and without trust, love is just an illusion.

From my experiences, both personally and professionally, I believe that most relationships (of any kind) founder due to lack of trust. Trust is absolutely fundamental, don't you think?

You said in an earlier post that you were a therapist yourself. How many times have you come across a wife saying about her husband, "It's not the fact that he had an affair I can't forgive, it's the breach of trust. Now I just can't believe him anymore." And it's that breach of trust which wrecks the relationship, not the ostensible act itself, whether it be an affair--hetero or homo--secret gambling, or whatever.

You also say in your earler post, "I'm sure you were referring to physical harm. It does however bother me when I read this statement (which is all too often). It's a matter of perspective. If it didn't hurt anybody, then why are there so many wives who either can't deal with it, leave, etc... This again shows me that there is still so little understanding about the range of emotions, turmoil, confusion and yes, even pain for the SO who finds out or is told that he husband is a CD'r. To negate the fact that it does hurt people on a mental and emotional level wouldn't be right. "

I agree entirely with what you say. But surely that all comes back to trust, in a way?

As a crossdresser, I always started any relationship with a woman by explaining what I was immediately at that point during the first date when I had decided I would like there to be a second--and more, perhaps. Obviously I would pick my moment--and I would have to think that the woman would want a second date with me--and I would explain myself in as good and unthreatening light as possible. Sure, there's disadvantages with that approach--from the male's point of view, at least--but none of the girls or women I was ever interested in felt that my behaviour somehow betrayed or threatened them. And none of them. to my knowledge, ever betrayed the trust I placed in them by telling them my secret. In fact, I suspect that one or two of them actually went out with me for a few dates simply because I had been so honest, and
trusting of them.

The advantages of upfront honesty by the male are so obvious they shouldn't need spelling out, and make his fear of rejection and exposure almost irrelevant. But it is equally important that the woman is honest too, both at the beginning of the relationship, and for as long as it lasts.
And that's another reason why I appreciate your honesty, Kay.

Kind regards, and take care.

Caroline.