Talking about feelings... worse than pulling teeth.

[CJ]

Hi all,

Jassmine, Elizabeth,

Great posts! Dialogue can do wonders.

About fear. Yes, there's the fear of being rejected (we all know that one, unfortunately), but, if I'm to be completely honest with myself, there's also, in my case, a certain fear of being accepted. Yes, accepted, I said. So much of my personality hangs on my seeing myself as an outsider, a gentle eccentric, that, should that eccentricity be taken away from me, I'm not sure where I'd stand. Plus, acceptance implies that I'd be much more free to explore who I am. But do I want to? It can be scary plumbing your own depths; what you find there isn't always pleasant. But it is human, at any rate.

I love these kinds of discussions. Keep it up!

Love.
CJ

[Elizabeth]

CJ,

I have been too afraid to broach this subject of fear of acceptance, but it has been a concern in my life. I have mentioned before that I am in a unique postion to deal with and accept my crossdressing because I am disabled and don't work.

But I have many times wondered what I would do if I had an accepting SO. When would I dress, and who would I tell? How would this affect my other personal relationships? Would it change who I am? Am I really just a crossdresser? Am I a transexual? Would I transition if I had an accepting SO?

These are frightening things. I have always known who I was, and what I was about. I spent my entire life almost, hiding who I really am. To the point that I lost touch with myself. I think this is what you may be talking about? Getting back to who you were before you had to put up a front.

I feel like I am the same exact person I have always been. I am transgendered. I would love to be a woman, but don't feel enough distress with my male body that I would transition. I feel quite fulfilled just being able to dress in women's clothes all the time.

There are other things though. I find I cry much easier now. I have alway hid that fact that I am a deeply emotional person who gets thier feelings hurt easily, gets sad easily, and can feel others happiness. I did this because people use this weakness against me. If people think you are rigid and uncaring about what others think, and feel, they don't try to hurt your feelings.

I have had some unusual experiences lately. I was watching "An Officer and a Gentleman" and I have seen this film at least 15 times. At the end I just broke into tears. It was such a happy and romantic end, it was just wonderful. Now I have felt great at the end of this movie many times and I am sure this is why it is one of my favorites, but this was the first time it ever made me cry.

More recently I was reading a thread here "Remembering 9/11"

http://crossdressers-forum.com/forums/v ... php?t=2417

I got to what was the last post by Eloise, and she had quoted Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg address, and I just burst into tears.



Now granted it is an incredible peice of prose, but even seeing it in person, at the Lincoln Memorial where I took this picture did not have such a profound impact on me.

It would seem that more than what I am able to wear has been freed. The person I am has been freed. And if this makes me too "unmanly" I am going to be ok with that.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[Jaye]

This is at the heart of my quandary. I am finally becoming a whole individual, independent of any other person. I don't need an SO or other entanglement to complete me. At the same time, I am coming to terms with what being a crossdresser means with regard to my place in the Universe.

My mother, God love her, wants me to start dating, to get back out there, so to speak. She seems to think that I need someone. It's true that I would like some companionship, but I'm not really looking to jump back into a relationship with anyone.

My ex-to-be knew I was a crossdresser almost from the time we met. She knew what she was getting into when she threw her lot in with mine. She's somewhat responsible for my being an "active" crossdresser, yet she ultimately rejected me. I guess she couldn't deal with the monster she created.

I'm going to Virginia next week to visit my parents, and while I'm there, I'm going to try to hook up with an old friend/girlfriend. She's the only other person who has ever accepted me as I am, however that was at the time. We've exchanged a couple of letters, and talked on the phone a couple times, but I've not seen her in person in six years. The last time we spoke, she told me she's always loved me, and that made me glow in a way I haven't in many years.

[Curly(SO)]

Elizabeth,

I would love for some other SO to chime in here who are not totally accepting and share thier views. Not that I don't value your's, but you are really the exception here. I mean you are the crossdressers dream of acceptance and understanding. I would like to hear from those who accept thier DH cding on a limited basis. As long as they do it in private, as long as they don't go out, as long as the kids don't know. As long as they are willing to keep thier dirty secret, a secret. I don't see how the average cder is ever going to gain self esteem, and trust as long as he is still held at fault.

This may apply to me, in a way, as I am happy for Ed to CD in private, but would have very mixed feelings about going public. (Although, I haven't put limitations on, as Ed has said he does not desire to go out dressed.)

I have said that I would be unhappy if Ed had real feminine eyebrows, I have said that I would find it difficult to deal with, if Ed did want to go out dressed....I don't think I am accepting Ed's CDing begrudgingly, or putting on limitations, ...but I am expressing my feelings. As much as you wish us (by which I mean SO's who have issues with CDing) to accept your CDing, we wish you to accept our feelings as valid, that is the only way forward.

I have given it much thought as to how I would feel if Ed went public. I believe that he is being honest in that he doesn't want to, but I do know that he wants people to know about this side of him, as he has dropped so many hints to friends (who seem to take it as a joke, as Ed usually says it in a way like he's just kidding). Well, one evening we were out with another couple, having a few drinks, and seemed like he really wanted to tell them about his CDing seriously. I have to say, that I was very uncomfortable, I didn't want him to tell them, and got the conversation turned round. It's not like a dirty secret, it just makes me feel embarrassed, I'm being honest here, as I just want you to understand it from my point of view.

Later, me and Ed talked about it, I think he felt like I was ashamed of him. I said, that it wasn't the appropriate time to talk about it, as we had all been drinking, I didn't want him to blurt out something he may regret. After all, once you have outted yourself, you can't go back. But if Ed really decided he wanted to tell people, after much thought, and while sober, I would of course, back him up. I would have to deal with my own negative feelings about this, but would need the support back, from him.

Actually, as much as love the masculine side of Ed, if he really wanted to be femme more, I know I would have the strength to deal with it, (hard as that may be) as I love him, and very importantly, he loves me unconditionally.

So, the bottom line for me is...I would prefer that Ed went out dressed in male clothes, that is how I like him to look....but if he had a strong need to go out enfemme, I would try to get over my embarrassment, and would accept it. It wouldn't be accepted begrudingly, but I would expect Ed to understand and accept how it would make me feel. It is a scary thought for me to imagine going out with Ed enfemme.

This sounds a bit contradictory, I suppose, in places, but I have contradictory feelings about all this!

It is not a case of being begrudging or holding at fault, it is really of accepting each others very real feelings. I know that negative feelings from an SO is horrible, but if I have had negative feelings, they have been about the CDing, NOT about my hubby, although it has been hard to get this across at times.

I hope this bit of rambling helps you understand a bit better how I and maybe some other SO's feel about it all. I hope some more SO's will post their views, as this is a very important thread, in understanding each other.

Love,
Curly(SO)

[Elizabeth]

Curly(SO),

Thank you so much for "chiming in" on this thread. I really appreciate it and I am certain others will too.

First I would like to say that it was not my intention to belittle your feelings or the feelings of other SO's. I do not think you feelings are any less real than our own.

The thing is, as crossdressers we have been trained in the same society that you have. We are embarrassed to be who we are. We know you are embarrassed to be our SO's and this becomes another source of anguish to feel guilt and shame over.

I am sure that there are not many women out there who would prefer that their DH were a crossdresser. I think we can safely take that off the table as agreed upon.

What I am trying to say is that what SO's perfer is not the issue here. I do not perfer to be who I am, I was not given a choice. No one ever said "hey, today is the day to decide if you want to be a crossdresser." While I am not trying to diminish your perferences, I must say that because I did not decide to be a crossdresser, what you or anyone else prefers is not relevant.

Any SO stating any perference to how a crossdresser should act, or feel, is invariably suppression, because he can not help what he feels inside. I told my wife whatever I thought she wanted to hear. Because it did not matter, she was not going to accept the truth. She thought as many SO's do, that by stating thier preference, that , that somehow would change thier DH into that.

It is my belief that this is just further repression. My fear of losing my wife was so great, that it became my mission to convince her that really I just had a panty fetish. But eventually she decided even that was intolerable.

But the whole time I was suppressing Elizabeth, I became an angry, depressed person. I was not living for me. I was living for her, and in the end, she really did not appreciate it anyway.

So? I while trying my best not to diminish the fact that you are truely embarrased, and you don't like looking at your husband when he looks like a woman. It does not change the fact that forcing you DH to change his behavior because of that embarrassment, or feelings of disgust at seeing another woman instead of the man you married, are still just repression and will prevent him from ever having real self esteem, because this is not true acceptance. It is saying that you don't really accept who he is, and I just don't see how he could ever feel like you accept him, as long as you don't really accept him, regardless of the feelings of embarrassment or shame you may feel.

I am sure as a SO it is not great thrill to have to tell you parents that you DH is a crossdresser. I am sure the looks you would get out in public with him dressed would be of non-approval. I am sure to many this would be extremely embarrassing.

I have heard, and I don't know it for a fact, that people's number one fear is public speaking. The fear of being publicly humiliated while speaking. This would explain the strong feelings people have about being out with a crossdresser, especially if it is your life mate. Death is the number two fear. People are more afraid of being publically humiliated than to die.

I can tell you, it takes a lot of courage to be a man in the "world of men" and dawn a dress and go out in public. But I am more at ease doing that, than to go out in boy clothes. I know I am being ridiculed behind my back. But the distress from not doing it, is so great, that I really would rather be dead than to have to go back into the closet.

The transgendered community suffers a 50% suicide rate. I have attempted suicide, and have had a suicide plan for over 25 years. I have gone years thinking about killing meself daily. I have heard many here talk about suidide attempts or the same daily suicidal thoughts. We fear never getting to be who we are, but we fear losing those we love to do it. It becomes so painful, that I have felt like there was just no out.

All this gets me back to where I started. If we have conditions on who we are, or who we can be, or who is allowed to know? Than we are not really accpeted, and we know it. We can never feel good about ourselves when we know we are compromising who we really were meant to be.

I don't see any way to resolve this because the SO's have just as much right to be who they are, and they may not be attracted to a husband who seemed so manly, but now is so feminine. It may violate the very fiber of thier moral being. No one can tolerate this. We all have to answer to our own moral being.

Until our society can accept this, and we stop teaching our children that crossdressing is wrong. Until our SO's and our friends and family can walk down the street with us and not feel ashamed, I don't see how it can be resolved. But? Interacial marriage, inter-religous marriage, homosexuality, segregation, and womens rights to dress as men, have all been overcome, and previously had the same social consequences.

It can only happen if people are willing to walk with us, and pretend they are not embarrassed long enough to stop feeling embarrassed.

That is my personal opinion.

Additional comments would be welcome.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[Curly(SO)]

Hi Elizabeth,

Thanks for your reply. You didn't belittle my feelings, but I feel I need to clarify some points!

Can I just say that I don't have a problem looking at my hubby when dressed enfemme, (even the eyebrow thing I'd get used to!) I don't feel disgust or shame and I certainly woudn't force my hubby to change his behaviour because of my embarrassment! all I would ask of him is- if we could talk about it first, be able to say, OK, this is how I feel, please know that, and help me deal with it. I would like to say also, that although I know my hubby didn't choose to be a CDer, I do, in fact choose to be with him, so my preferences are relevant! I am not stating that I prefer my hubby to act or feel a certain way, all I stated was that I prefer it if he went out in public in male attire. I would never try to stop him if he wanted to go out enfemme, I would voice my worries and fears, but we would support each other, and as you rightly say, we would 'pretend not to be embarrassed long enough to stop feeling embarrassed'. that is a good line, Elizabeth!

Ed's CDing doesn't violate my moral being in any way, and he is just as manly as ever. This was a hard concept for me at first, I could not assimilate my hubby's manliness with his CDing, but I certainly have now, his manliness has not diminished in my eyes, at all!

Sorry, Elizabeth, if this is sounds harsh, it is not meant to be. I just wanted you to understand where I'm coming from! It all goes back to CJ's original response to Mimi's post. I am an accepting SO, me and Ed have got to a good understanding of each other's feelings by communicating...sometimes by communicating negative stuff. It hasn't always been easy, but me and Ed have a strong respect and love for each other that sees us through.

I think it needs to be remembered that most CDers have had a lifetime of thinking about CDing, learning to accept it, making sense of it and how it affects them. I personally, have had less than a year, so I have a long way to go, in really dealing with how it all makes me feel, ( I will always be honest about how I feel) and I think I have done pretty damn well!

Love,
Curly(SO)

[Beauty]

Hi Elizabeth and Curly,

I think this was an excellent discussion and I applaud both of you for being so mature in your responses.

Elizabeth I didn't know we had a 50% suicide rate. Where'd you get that figure? I know the suicide rate with TS' is high, but I didn't think CD'r suicide rates were that high. (That's the only thing that I saw in your post that I had a question about.)

Ok Curly... it's been a year and you think you're doing a good job? What makes you so sure? After what I read I can tell you, I personally don't think you're doing a good job though. Why do I say that? How do I rate you? Well I think you're doing an awesome, fantastic, great, incredible, loving, outstanding, super duper awesome job. Did I getchya'? lol (meaning, did you think I was kind of going to be negative there)

Your hubby is soooo lucky to have you because you love him for him. Thanks for posting the way you cope in this thread it's a great display of what love is. Your love and acceptance is awesome!

Thanks again to the both of you!

Beauty

[Curly(SO)]

Thanks Beauty!


You got me...my bottom lip started to pout but it turned into a big grin

love,
Curly(SO)

[Beauty]

[Terri(SO)]

Wow, I think this has been the most refreshing and enlightened discussion thread I've read here or elsewhere. I have been following some threads and been feeling that, in some of the relationship discussions, the CD is the least of the problems presented.
I listen to whether an SO is accepting or not or to what degree. About lack of communication and trust in relationships. I admire Jassmine in her ability to not only accept her partner but also herself (often harder, don't you think?). I wonder how many CDs fully accept everything about their SO just as unconditionally as they expect acceptance from her about something it has taken (for some) a lifetime to accept about themselves.
My CD talks about fear alot. I don't understand it so much but it may be that my fears are simply different from his. They don't live as close to the surface as they always have for him. When I think of fear, I think of crawly things and bears when camping ;-) but fear is part of his daily life and that is even harder to understand than why he wants to wear girdles and high heels (ouch!).

[Jassmine(SO)]

Howdy Curly

Hi Elizabeth,

Thanks for your reply. You didn't belittle my feelings, but I feel I need to clarify some points!

Can I just say that I don't have a problem looking at my hubby when dressed enfemme, (even the eyebrow thing I'd get used to!) I don't feel disgust or shame and I certainly woudn't force my hubby to change his behaviour because of my embarrassment! all I would ask of him is- if we could talk about it first, be able to say, OK, this is how I feel, please know that, and help me deal with it. I would like to say also, that although I know my hubby didn't choose to be a CDer, I do, in fact choose to be with him, so my preferences are relevant! I am not stating that I prefer my hubby to act or feel a certain way, all I stated was that I prefer it if he went out in public in male attire. I would never try to stop him if he wanted to go out enfemme, I would voice my worries and fears, but we would support each other, and as you rightly say, we would 'pretend not to be embarrassed long enough to stop feeling embarrassed'. that is a good line, Elizabeth!

Ed's CDing doesn't violate my moral being in any way, and he is just as manly as ever. This was a hard concept for me at first, I could not assimilate my hubby's manliness with his CDing, but I certainly have now, his manliness has not diminished in my eyes, at all!

Sorry, Elizabeth, if this is sounds harsh, it is not meant to be. I just wanted you to understand where I'm coming from! It all goes back to CJ's original response to Mimi's post. I am an accepting SO, me and Ed have got to a good understanding of each other's feelings by communicating...sometimes by communicating negative stuff. It hasn't always been easy, but me and Ed have a strong respect and love for each other that sees us through.

I think it needs to be remembered that most CDers have had a lifetime of thinking about CDing, learning to accept it, making sense of it and how it affects them. I personally, have had less than a year, so I have a long way to go, in really dealing with how it all makes me feel, ( I will always be honest about how I feel) and I think I have done pretty damn well!

Love,
Curly(SO)

I think you have done pretty damn well, too!! Communication is the key to understanding. It is never easy to talk about the not so pleasant stuff but it is neseccary. And you are absolutely correct in the fact that Ed needs to be respectful of your feelings as much as you need to be respectful of his. Relationships are a two way street.

Ed is very lucky to have you in his life And you are indeed very lucky to have him He sounds like a wonderful man

*Hugs & Love*

[CJ]

Hi all,

Wow! This thread is turning out to be so much more "real" than I had hoped it would be! Elizabeth, Curly, and all the others, thanks for participating. This is great!

Both Elizabeth and Curly have so well presented their points of view that I can truly say that, for the first time, I really have a far better grasp of the emotional issues involved on either side (and, as Jassmine pointed out, what common ground there may be).

Yes, we cannot deny who we are without paying a heavy emotional price for it.

Now, does the sentence above apply to crossdressers or to their SO's? I think it applies not only to both but to all human beings, everywhere. The anguish an SO may feel at discovering she's partnered with a CD (something, as Curly and many other SO's have pointed out, is largely outside the scope of their previous experience) is no less real than that of a CD (or of any other person who has a "transgressive" sexual identity). That we (crossdressers) have had to "crush" our deepest selves in order to be part of a society that has no love for us is--aside from being thoroughly ironic--the surest road to mental hell.

From a gender therapist's work:

In addition to the enormous emotional and social difficulties inherent in simply being human; and the further difficulties that result from having one’s identity denied; and the additional problems imposed by being an outlaw and outsider by fiat and not by choice, by who s/he is, rather than by what s/he does, many transgendered people may well develop some emotional problems that we might genuinely call Adjustment Disorders with Mixed Disturbance of Emotions and Conduct: a DSM-IV diagnosis that I have been told, incidentally, some insurance companies may read as a clinical attempt to use a reimbursable code for the usually unreimbursable borderline personality disorder.

If personality disorders sometimes seem to come with the territory of identity denial, anxiety might well accompany the conflict and confusion of living with a secret you cannot tell anyone, whether on the playground, at home, at work, or in bed. Social issues from agoraphobia to drug abuse to lying to outraged or despairing actings-out might come to feel like expedient and salutary responses to a world that denies you in a very fundamental way. And depression is even a likely concomitant of having been told all your life that you are not who you always knew yourself to be.

-- COMING OUT TRANS: Questions of Identity for Therapists Working with Transgendered Individuals, by William A. Henkin, Ph.D., Copyright © 2001

Generally, these kinds of difficulties (what shrinks refer to as being "ego-dystonic"--literally, "unhappy with one's self") are often ones that "normal" people (including, of course, our SO's) don't often have to contend with, within themselves. However, I don't think that means they don't understand what we're going (and have gone) through or that our SO's love us any the less for it. As Curly mentioned, it's the behaviour, not the person, that raises issues with her (I agree with Beauty, her love for Ed shines through in everything she writes). But, to me, this is the problem: what happens when the behaviour and the person are one and the same? This is the very point raised by Elizabeth. We transgendered folks do not choose to be the way we are; we just are that way (and, no, I don't want to get into the whole nurture vs. nature debate, here--at this stage, it's a moot point). What are we to do? Moreover, what are the women who love us, and who are partnered to us, to do?

I think this is where communication plays a central role. Let each other know how you feel about things, about each other, about yourselves, about society, whatever. Having a "transgressive" sexual identity is precisely that, in the eyes of others, a transgression. It's a taboo. All the more so for being a sexual taboo. An SO (or a family member or whoever else) is naturally bound to resist being drawn into violating this taboo. (It's this "moral" dimension that Elizabeth and Curly are referring to.) Doing so goes against everything they've been taught about what it means to be a man or a woman. Now, we CD's have an edge, here, so to speak; we've had our whole lives to try to figure out how we fit (or don't fit) into these traditional social roles (of course, once we've understood--if we ever do--that there is, indeed, a "fitting" problem). Yes, there's tremendous pain and anguish that accompanies this process. But it's a process that's made many of us much wiser than we would otherwise have been when it comes to what it can possibly mean to be human. Those who haven't gone through this "self-puzzle-solving" (again, by virtue not of their deeds or status but of their very being) can--and often do--find it hard to understand what we may be feeling, or even talking about. This, of course, can include our SO's.

By the same token, have we (crossdressers) ever been put in a position where we'd rather not deal with, or do, something that doesn't come naturally to us? Yes. Being fully a "man's man" comes to mind. Well, it's the same thing with SO's. Their having "to deal with" our transgenderedness is very much on a par with our having "to deal with" our own maleness. How much can we embrace our own maleness? Do we even try? Our expectation that our SO's should be able to deal with our "femaleness," simply because it's an integral part of who we are, while not unreasonable in itself, doesn't mean that they should do so gladly, any more than we can gladly deal with the fact that we are male, not female. As with everything else that belongs to the human mind and the human heart, a necessary period of adjustment is required. That adjustment implies a healthy communication between two people. Without it, you face a hardening of the heart, a disillusionment, a withdrawal, and, eventually, the death of a relationship.

So. Communicate. Talk about your feelings. Let the other know who you are. (Incidentally, this is also a great to way to discover who we are.) There's too much to be gained by it not to.

By the way, I quote Elizabeth and Curly a lot, and use them as examples, here, but what I said is meant to be taken generally. I'm especially targeting myself when I say these things. I've found that this is what worked for me.

Peace and love to all,
CJ

[Jassmine(SO)]

Hi MariasGirl

Wow, I think this has been the most refreshing and enlightened discussion thread I've read here or elsewhere. I have been following some threads and been feeling that, in some of the relationship discussions, the CD is the least of the problems presented. I listen to whether an SO is accepting or not or to what degree. About lack of communication and trust in relationships.

I admire Jassmine in her ability to not only accept her partner but also herself (often harder, don't you think?)..

Thank you Yep, I think learning to find self acceptance is quite difficult. One must look at all aspects of their being, and looking at some of that stuff can be scary. It can also be quite painful. Then one must learn how to accept parts of their nature they may not like, but cannot change. The road of self discovery and self acceptance can get rocky at times but it is one of the most awesome journeys I have ever been on ##oo##

I wonder how many CDs fully accept everything about their SO just as unconditionally as they expect acceptance from her about something it has taken (for some) a lifetime to accept about themselves.

Thank you for raising this very excellent point! I have often wondered the very same thing. It would be nice to hear from the CDers out there about this.

*Hugs & Love*

[Elizabeth]

Beauty,

My bad, I stand corrected. I got that information from a post of Julie M

Julie M wrote:
One fact I didn't know is there is a 50% mortality rate among those born as transsexual. Many commit suicide and the rest meet an early death trying to become the opposite gender. That speaks volumes on how screwed up our society is if that fact isn't out there as general knowledge. This I find appaling.

As you see, I was incorrect, as it was transexuals she was talking about. Here as a link to the thread.

http://crossdressers-forum.com/forums/v ... ght=#26884

Curly(SO) wrote:
Sorry, Elizabeth, if this is sounds harsh, it is not meant to be. I just wanted you to understand where I'm coming from! It all goes back to CJ's original response to Mimi's post. I am an accepting SO, me and Ed have got to a good understanding of each other's feelings by communicating...sometimes by communicating negative stuff. It hasn't always been easy, but me and Ed have a strong respect and love for each other that sees us through.

I don't feel it is harsh at all, in fact I appreciate your willingness to share your thoughts and feelings with all of us. I think I need to clarify something here. It is not my beleif that the SO has an obligation to accept her CDer and his CDing. It is my beleif that failure to do so is a dead end street. However, it is equally a dead end street for any SO to accept that which she can not truely accept.

Elizabeth wrote:
I don't see any way to resolve this because the SO's have just as much right to be who they are, and they may not be attracted to a husband who seemed so manly, but now is so feminine. It may violate the very fiber of thier moral being. No one can tolerate this. We all have to answer to our own moral being.

When the SO does not fully accept the true nature of her CDing DH, it is still rejection in the mind of the CDer. This is why they are reluctant to open up anymore. They are back to defense. Back to self preservation. I can tell you from my own experience. Once it was obvious my wife was not going to accept me, it became "damage control". I had to start thinking about the ways she could and eventually would use this against me. The last thing on my mind was telling her more. Because us crossdressers are the ones who are not accepted, our SO can immediately regain the graces of society by simply dumping us. We on the other hand are not going to regain the grace of society by divorcing. I think us crossdressers are very much aware that our SO can get rid of the problem, by getting rid of us, an option we do not have.

I think many crossdressers, who are on a leash, are in "damage control". As happened with me, they may reget having told you, or getting caught. They realize thier dream of really getting to be themselves is not going to happen. So the idea of talking more about it, and giving our SO more to use against us later, if she so chooses, does not seem like a good idea, at least that is how I felt.

And if all that were not enough, when we were getting up the courage to tell you our secret, we were hoping that you loved us enough to really accept us. Just finding out that you can't/won't accept us entirely, is such a blow to our already fragile self-esteem, it creates a whole new set of problems and feelings to deal with.

This thread started out about how many SO are frustrated with thier CD not opening up to them. I hope I have been able to shed some light on why this happens without offending anyone. It is after all, just my opinion. Each of you have you own experiences to draw upon in our quest for understanding. I have found this to be an extremely enlightening thread and would like to thank everyone who has contributed so far, and would encourage anyone who is reading but might have something to add, to please do so.

I do love you all, and I love this wonderful place that brings us together to try to find understanding where there was none before.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[CJ]

Hi all,

Jassmine wrote: The road of self discovery and self acceptance can get rocky at times but it is one of the most awesome journeys I have ever been on.

Yes! Yes! Yes! Same here. Really, is there any other journey that will ever matter as much as this one?

About MG's wondering if CD's accept their SO's as unconditionally as they themselves want to be accepted, I really do think that it isn't ever possible for someone to fully accept another person unless, and until, they've first learned to accept themselves. A tall order, to say the least. In my own life, I try. I don't always succeed. But, rather than seeing this as a form of defeat (and let that deflate me), it only motivates me to try a little harder. I'm very enthusiastic that way.

Love,
CJ