Acceptance vs. Understanding

[Terri(SO)]

Acceptance vs. Understanding

In practical terms, what is the difference?

Is it not enough that a woman works at accepting this part (CD) of her man and giving him the emotional and physical space to express this part of himself?

Is it even possible for a woman to truly understand something that the man himself freely admits he does not really understand himself?

Is it possible for a man to understand the lifetime of societal and hormonal conditioning that women experience without experiencing it firsthand?

[Kersten Lee]

Terri SO,

I see acceptance as a spiritual thing. Faith and or belief that everything is ok even if all can't be explained or understood. It's about how we each define and feel about the meaning of love. Can we accept and love each other even if all things are not explainable or understandable.

I find I feel spiritually separated from some of the discussions here. No matter, man or woman, we all experienced what we know of life as individuals. The problem being, for me is, how are we to come together as a nation or country for the good of all when very few of us can love and accept our mates as they are. Many of us have difficulty in supporting the other striving to find fulfilment and happiness in life by what ever means define what happiness or fulfillment means to the other.

I see myself and others wanting to continue to define and sell our own set of pre-packaged rules for life, happiness and behavior. I still find myself selling my wife my beliefs and ideals while ignoring hers.

Acceptance in some ways is easier than understanding. Acceptance is a passive act. To understand and discover why we feel, think and act the way we do, takes much work and internal soul searching for the answers of the why. Without the basis of understanding our own motivations, I feel it becomes near impossible to understand our loved one. At that point it seems the initial acceptance fades to fear and more questions that are impossible to answer. We then return to our old comfortable boxed ideals that leave no room for behaviors of a mate that fall again outside our own definitions.

In my view, it seems compromise or the willingness to at least ponder another's views is fading in this country. I participated in this growing division all summer. I feel a lot of these divisions are continuing yet as they are in homes and in the country. It is starting to feel like a new civil war is brewing in this country.

I wish I could become a healer, and get more people to increase their acceptance of others and also to grow in the abilities to explore what it takes to gain understanding. I see many doing this very thing here, but as of late my voice calling for more goodness has been silent.

Kersten

[Jassmine(SO)]

Hi Terri

Excellent questions. Ah, there is indeed a difference between accepting something and understanding something. One doesn't "need" to understand something to accept it. But neither does understanding something make accepting it easier. For instance: I accept that war is necessary in order for us to know what peace is, but I do not understand man's inhumanity towards his fellow man. I probably never will, but that's ok I also accept that hate is necessary so we know what love is, but once again hatred is something I do not understand. On the other hand I understand why bigotry exisits, but I do not accept it and I try to educate people to try and help eliminate it.

Sometimes one must just accept that something is, just because it is.

From my own view point I have found that accepting something is easier, for the most part, than working to gain an understanding of it. So, I work backwards I accept something first and then see if I can figure out the "why". But sometimes I need to figure out the "why" before I can accept something. I hope that makes sense.

Is it not enough that a woman works at accepting this part (CD) of her man and giving him the emotional and physical space to express this part of himself?

Ah, now here is an example of where I accept who one is, and then see if I can figure out why the person is who they are. I cannot change anyone and I wouldn't even bother to try. I have found that by accepting someone as is, and letting any issues I may have with that person go, I have been a much happier camper

Is it even possible for a woman to truly understand something that the man himself freely admits he does not really understand himself?

Hmmmm....In my opinion it may just be possible. Different people take in and "digest" information differently. So, one person may understand something another does not. Also looking in from the outside gives one a broader view and may also lead to understanding something another does not. For example: I "know" myself quite well and have a very good understanding of why I am who I am, but every now and again Ahzz, will "hit" on something about me, I haven't seen or grasped yet. And vice versa.

Is it possible for a man to understand the lifetime of societal and hormonal conditioning that women experience without experiencing it firsthand?

I would think that on a surface level an understanding of this is possible. It would depend on how much time a man spends with women and how in tune he is with himself and them. But a deeper understanding would have to come from experience. That goes for anything, though.

*Hugs & Love*

[Kyra]

I wish I could become a healer, and get more people to increase their acceptance of others and also to grow in the abilities to explore what it takes to gain understanding.

Wow Kersten, that's so inspiring! Wish I had a magic wand of my own.

Terri, the only thing I can add is that acceptance is akin to blind faith.

There's so much of myself that I still don't understand, but I feel that as I search inward, I learn. The more I learn, the more I understand. It seems to be a never ending process.
I think I'd better stop babbling.

Hugs,
Kyra

[Beauty]

Acceptance vs. Understanding

In practical terms, what is the difference?

I'm not sure. I do wonder though if anyone defined it would we all agree.

Is it not enough that a woman works at accepting this part (CD) of her man and giving him the emotional and physical space to express this part of himself?

I think it's enough if she feels (all defined by her) she's doing all she could, all she can, the best they can do, and most importantly if she feels she is doing as much as she wants to. Again all of those limits would be defined by her.

Is it even possible for a woman to truly understand something that the man himself freely admits he does not really understand himself?

No, I wouldn't call it possible. Especially if the man himself doesn't understand.

Is it possible for a man to understand the lifetime of societal and hormonal conditioning that women experience without experiencing it firsthand?

This question I think about a lot. The answer is no. I do have a question though, because of the way I read the final question. To me it read like you really want to understand something or it's something you've read or experience that left a sour taste somewhere? Why did you ask that question?

I really appreciate you starting a thread like this. It's time to test the temperature of the forum regarding SOs asking questions where CD'rs could perceive it wrong and rebut rather than answer. I know a few SOs are going to keep an eye on this thread to make sure conversations stay civil.

I'm really asking everyone who responds to do your best to write in a way that's not confrontational. I wish I had a clue how to tell you how to do that, but since I don't we'll all have to use our own discretion. The only way to tell really is the perception Terri and other SOs get our replies to the questions. So far so good. Unless I just said something wrong.

I think we'll do fine.

Beauty

[Loretta Ann]

Hi all,

Wow !!! some very intelligent responses here. This is the kind of dialog that I enjoy. The simple exchange of ideas.

For me the only way that I can accept some of those who are so different than I am, is through the understanding that I am not responsible for them. I think it is part of what is called letting go.

That dose not mean that I even want to accept some of there beliefs, nor are we required to.

I think it is easier for those who live with a CD if it is already something that does not bother them. It must be a huge task to attempt to accommodate that under any other circumstances. And I totally respect those SOs who are able to accomplish that. I have to admit that it is something I can not understand.

In my view, it seems compromise or the willingness to at least ponder another's views is fading in this country. I participated in this growing division all summer. I feel a lot of these divisions are continuing yet as they are in homes and in the country. It is starting to feel like a new civil war is brewing in this country.

Kersten

I was not raised in an environment where compromise or the willingness to at least ponder another's views was a reality. Although today my network of friends consist of those who in fact do, or have done just that. I suspect that those kind of people always existed, but that I was excluding myself from them due to the fact that I had not yet grown beyond what I had learned as a child.

I have had my life played back at me many times since I started to work on myself, and at times find myself having to move on while leaving others who are where I was once at where they are, due to the same ignorance I once displayed. And that saddens me as my heart hurts for those who are still stuck there.

I wish I could become a healer, and get more people to increase their acceptance of others and also to grow in the abilities to explore what it takes to gain understanding. I see many doing this very thing here, but as of late my voice calling for more goodness has been silent.

I identify with that, but once again it appears that my responsibility is to let go and let them experience the same kind of suffering that I have experienced, that I so wished they could avoid.

For some folks (just as it was for me for years) Hell is where they seem to prefer and/or need to live. At least for a part of their lives. It could be some need to spend some time there so that they can appreciate it, and recognize it when the good life is shown to them. That certainly is the situation in my life.

I see myself and others wanting to continue to define and sell our own set of pre-packaged rules for life, happiness and behavior.

I welcome those who will present their views on this, I did not have the benefit of others thoughts and experiences from which to choose from. However I resent it when one try's to force it down my throat.

Love Darlene.

[Kersten Lee]

Terri SO,

I fear I missed the center of your questions. After reading Beauty and rereading your post I see the between the lines that Beauty may have seen that I missed.

I do hope you feel free enough with us to trust and share more of what you are feeling. I believe feelings have more to do with the world than academics, numbers and definitions.


Darlene,

Thanks for the considerate response. I have posted less, being busy, and also feeling I was unable to communicate with out selling.

Kersten

[Loretta Ann]

Kersten,

In my opinion the way you communicated in your posts in this thread are fine. No matter how well one communicates there will always be those who will attempt to put the spin on it that you are trying to sell and/or confront.

That is nothing more than a defense mechanism used by those who have a need to do that. And (for those people) it usually takes a very serious crises in their life before, they will consider that there may be a better way.

Those are the people that I have a burden for. Why does it need to be like that?

Love Darlene.

[Terri(SO)]

I appreciate all the responses!
The reason I ask is really want to know. I’ve been thinking about this for about a year an a half and reading what other SOs have written. I feel that I’m a relatively intelligent and open minded person and have come to a point where I’m not sure I can really ever understand CD. At low moments it feels like a failure.

I have accepted it in Maria but I don’t understand why he wants/needs to do it. For us, it seems its ok that I don’t understand, at least for this moment in time.

For the other CDs, is it enough to have acceptance ?

[Beauty]

Hi Terri,

I know it would be enough for me. You're not a failure at all. You're totally a HUGE success!!!!

Acceptance was your finish line. Tolerance takes a little more work and time. Once you've gotten acceptance though I feel you've got it all and you truly have accepted him. I hope that helped.

Beauty

[DonnaT]

Hi Terri,

I know it would be enough for me. You're not a failure at all. You're totally a HUGE success!!!!

Acceptance was your finish line. Tolerance takes a little more work and time. Once you've gotten acceptance though I feel you've got it all and you truly have accepted him. I hope that helped.

Beauty

Couldn't agree more. As I mentioned to Amber in another thread. Acceptance is what we really want.

There is no need to understand. Trying to understand why we CD, is like beating a dead horse. Not going anywhere.

As long as out SO's accept that this is a need/urge we cannot control, the reason isn't that important. Scientists are trying to figure this out.

The basis, in my understanding, is that the brain is intersexed. Much in the same manner that a hermaphrodite ahs intersexed genitalia.

There is no logical reason not to believe that what can happen to a persons genetics to cause the intersexing of the genetalia, cannot also happen to the genetics of the brain.

[Loretta Ann]

Terri,

Were I to pursue another marriage and/or mate I believe acceptance would be adequate.

Choosing to remain single the only acceptance that is important is that of my own.

Love Darlene.

[Stef]

For the other CDs, is it enough to have acceptance ?

Hi Terri!

I'll be perfectly honest, I consider tolerance of this lifestyle as huge step. To have someone accept it is a true gift!

Hugs,
Stef

[Kersten Lee]

Terri,

Thanks for sharing more with us. I have been in therapy for many problems in my mind that have kept me from knowing and feeling love and happiness.

I and my wife thought that I could be cured of the need to cross-dress. I have not. Many other problems have gone away. The thing is, that there was no diffinitive answer as to why I love to shop and dress and need to look and feel pretty. It really is a part of me. I could have went on dressing and then feeling self loathing and hate or just accept this. I found I do not do it to be in competion with my wife for the female role. I don't do it to hurt or shock people. I don't do it to attract other men. I don't do this to hurt my wife. I am loyal and faithful and always have been.

I don't fully understand why it helps me to feel whole and complete, but it does. As you said, so how can my wife understand and is acceptance enough? My wife understands that this was always a part of me and understands that I am happier being free around her to be pretty and comfortable in a skirt and top. It has been a long journey that is not yet over.

My wife does not accept and is unwilling to share my need to be around other people dressed. This need is tied to my happiness to be free to express my innerself threw outward expression. She is unwilling to say that she would still love and support me if I were to be exposed and the consequences that could occur. I feel that I disrespect her needs by me expressing my needs. I don't know how this will be resolved to both our satisfactions. I could accept and embrace her wishes or she could accept mine. I don't know if a middle compromise can be found satisfactory to us both.

Respect for each other is a basis, but drawing the line where acceptance for each of us ends is more difficult. There is not always a concrete answer that satisfies both our boundries. The struggle to be content is continuing with us both.

I hope that you and your husband's needs can be met together with less struggle than we have been through.

Take Care,
Kersten

[Elizabeth]

Terri,

First let me just say how glad I am to see you take on such a bold topic. I really like seeing this coming from a SO.

Terri(SO) wrote:

Acceptance vs. Understanding

In practical terms, what is the difference?

In pratical terms there is not a great deal of difference. When the crossdresser asks for acceptance he is asking that you continue to love him, want him, and respect him in spite of this need. And when he asks for understanding he is really asking that you understand that he has this unexplicable need that defies reason and has no control over. He asks you to understand that he is not a bad person. He asks you to understand that he did not choose this and can not stop this. And he asks you for this understanding, so you can accept him.

Terri(SO) wrote:

Is it not enough that a woman works at accepting this part (CD) of her man and giving him the emotional and physical space to express this part of himself?

I am not sure I understand this part, but I get the impression you are asking if "tolerance" which allows for emotional and physical space to express this part of themsleves, is the same as acceptance? "is it not enough". My answer would be, well it depends. As humans we all have three fundemental needs. Security, which includes food, shelter, sense of safety. Love, which I dare not define. And acceptance, a sense of belonging. We are social creatures. We thrive in groups. "no man is an island". So? is you are asking if working on acceptance is the same as acceptance, my anwser is no. You can work on accepting someone, but right up until the moment you accept them, you are not accepting them.

Terri(SO) wrote:

Is it even possible for a woman to truly understand something that the man himself freely admits he does not really understand himself?

My short answer is no. At least not as you worded it. Again, I beleive when the crossdresser asks for understanding he is not asking that you understand why he crossdresses, but asks that you understand that he does not control his desire to dress. And the other reasons I listed above.

Terri(SO) wrote:

Is it possible for a man to understand the lifetime of societal and hormonal conditioning that women experience without experiencing it firsthand?

I don't think it is possible. I also don't think you could get any number of women together who could even agree on just what exactly that would mean. I think that just as each man is conditioned by society differently, so are women. As crossdressers it has been my experience, at least from being here, that each of our experiences, needs, and beliefs are so different. For me personally, I don't feel a need to act like a woman. I have a need to express this part of me that clearly is feminine. I don't know why it feels so good to put on women's clothes, makeup, jewelry, and mannerisms. All I know is that I have this need to do it and can not be happy unless I do. I don't think of it in terms of "do I feel like a woman?". I think of it in terms of, "I don't feel what other men feel". I don't feel attractive as a man. I don't feel the need to have everything be a competition to prove that women would prefer me. I am not brave, I am afraid to go fast in cars, I am afraid to be in high places, I am afraid of large animals like horses. I don't like vicious breeds of dogs. I don't have a desire to kill animals to prove my "manhood". Killing animals makes me feel bad. I don't know what a woman feels like, I guess one would have to have a baby to truely answer that. All I know is that when I dress as one it allows me to feel pretty, and attractive, somthing I just can not feel in male clothing. This allows me to like myself.

Terri(SO) wrote:

The reason I ask is really want to know. I’ve been thinking about this for about a year an a half and reading what other SOs have written. I feel that I’m a relatively intelligent and open minded person and have come to a point where I’m not sure I can really ever understand CD. At low moments it feels like a failure.

I certainly consider you to be an intelligent person. And your presence here shows you certainly are openminded. You know Terri, I think all us crossdressers go through a time, or many times, of feeling just like you. But like you, we are not failures, but survivors. I have spent at least 30 years trying to understand crossdressing, and I have seen many people here talk about not understanding it, other that it is a need. The reasons are vague and as different than the people that have this need. To me it is like asking why someone has a favorite color. There is no reason one color should be prefered over another. If it were, we would all have the same favorite color. So here is a mind experiment for you. See if you can change your favorite color? You may talk yourself into it for a while, but in the end, your favorite color will always be your favorite color. Crossdressing is the same.

Love always,
Elizabeth